From some of the experiments on heat treating, could one conclude there is a difference or no difference in the rate of moisture absorption between heat treated and non-heat treated bamboo?

If there is no difference, I'm wondering why we go to the trouble of heat treating other than color and straightening when the strips are bound or treated in a fixture. Also; I don't see why we need the high temp, 325° - 375°, to drive out moisture/straighten when 200° for a longer period of time would achieve the same goal. Thoughts anyone?  (Don Schneider)

Many years ago there was a discussion on this list about whether heat treating was needed, or maybe it was one of those things done just because it has always been done. So I made a rod without any heat treating at all - or maybe I should say I made a blank because I never finished to the point where I put guides and a handle on it. When bent the blank would hold the bend for about half an hour and slowly return to straight. I taped on guides and test cast it. The term "felt like a wet noodle" took on a whole new meaning. Driving out moisture is not the only change bamboo goes through when heat treating.  (Darryl Hayashida)

John Long says if you flame, you don't need to heat treat any more than that.  I made two Young Perfectionists from the same culm, one flamed and heat treated the other just flamed.  I don't claim to be an expert either in rodmaking or fly casting, but my son-in-law is an excellent caster/fisherman and HE can't tell any difference in them.  How they will stand up over time is still a question, of course.  (Neil Savage)

I did a series of test years ago that were published in the Planing Form. Cane used came from the same culm - strips side by each. Each tapered and treated @ various times/temps. Conclusion - heat treating is a myth. Untreated cane performed better than some treated cane. Still, I heat treat. No sense flying in the face of convention.

My testing was replicated by Tom Folk who came to the same conclusion. If anyone has done similar testing that is not subjective, I'd certainly like to hear from them.  (Don Anderson)

Sorry, but my testing was actually making a non heat treated rod - real world application, not test strips, and I'm going to continue heat treating.  (Darryl Hayashida)

A thought came to mind. I think we all agree that the physical properties of bamboo change during heat treating. Supposedly for the better for our uses. The thought is; does the hardness/durability of bamboo change during the process?  The spectrum is form none to burned but where is the optimum? Has anyone ever checked the hardness and correlated an optimum from the results? Or are we saying, that's the way the Masters did it and that makes it right?

Any thoughts?  (Don Anderson)

John Long's Grand experiment had one rod that was the same Waara taper as all the others but not heat treated. When I and many others cast it we could not tell the difference between it and the original taper heat treated. Perhaps John could chime in on the "set" aspect, since the rod had been around for two more years and may have been fished enough to take a set. Also, wouldn't glue joint "creep" potentially be a bigger issue in sets and wet noodles than heat treating the cane?

Also, wouldn't glue joint "creep" potentially be a bigger issue in sets and wet noodles than heat treating the cane?  (Doug Easton)

My Grand Experiment rod did not have any heat treating.  Checked it about 5 minutes ago and it still does not have a set.  It was also a spiral.  (Scott Grady)

Interesting...

A non heat treated spiral rod. Seems to retain it's stiffness and doesn't take a set. Something to look into. (Darryl Hayashida)

I think there is something to this. Lambuth never heat treated, and no one complains about his rods, BUT, he was apparently very accomplished at selecting cane. I believe you could get away with more in a spiral rod than a straight one, but I doubt you could compensate for really poor cane. Let me turn the question on it's head. Has anyone seen a rod that was heat treated to a significant color change that DID take a set easily? I never have.  (Tom Smithwick)

If by not heat treated you mean the bamboo was flamed with no  further heat treatment after, I can see this happening. I used to do that myself - flame just the outside of a culm, split and plane from there. In fact, most of the rods I have made have never seen the inside of an oven. I don't currently own an oven even now. That's why I said I consider flaming a heat treatment, and I mean flaming the way most other people do it, not the way I mega flame the inside of my culms.

I eliminated glue creep as a reason my non heat treated rod stayed bent because it did straighten out by itself in about a half hour. If it was glue creep it would have stayed bent - at least a little, and I would have seen some sort of displacement between the strips.  (Darryl Hayashida)